France’s chief rabbi is warning Jews in France to wear baseball caps instead of skull caps to avoid being attacked in the streets. This comes after a Jewish middle school was burned to the ground in an arson attack.
UPDATE: Justin notes that the French government is trying to fight this wave of anti-Semitism. The question is, will it be a matter of too little too late? Only time will tell, but the mood among many French Jews is one of great worry at this point.
It seems as if you are guilty of only telling half the story. Jacques Chirac has loudly condemned recent incidents and has opened up a regeneration plan for predominately Muslim suburbs where most of these attacks are taking place. When added to the new curriciulum changes in schools to fight anti-Semitism that were added over the summer, it seems if the situation is not as bleak as you would paint it.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3282335.stm
of course it isn’t, but it’s very hard to justify the killings of hundreds of palestinian if in your opponent country (ideologically France here) there’s nothing but peace…
With this news of hate and hopeless situation in France, it’s a lot better: for those who have actually seen “Bowling for Columbine”, this is another aplication of the “freak everyone up” strategy M.Moore told us about!
I think the anti-semitism argument has been way too used recently…watch out not to erode it for wrong reasons…
Vincent,
So Jews don’t really get attacked in France? Jewish temples and schools are not firebombed? This is just made up stuff, right? Also, why are europeans refusing to release the anti semitism study?
As for “Bowling for Columbine”, even Moore admitted that its not a documentary. When pressed on teh facts, he said he doesn’t have to asnwer, cause its a “comedy”.
Silly french.
first of all, I haven’t (yet 😉 been elected as a european deputy, so I’m just talking for myself. Don’t ask ME why they don’t release the whole thing. Very recently, there was another report that was not published because of US/Saudis relations, so I guess it is pretty normal for a big institution. I also think that putting “ennemies” on a list -or an “axis”- is never really efficient, as it stops any kind of dialogue. I wxouldn’ tblame Europe for that.
Secondly, the Oklahoma bombing wasn’t an islamic attack as people first thought it was: so before pointing anyone for the ONE jewish school that burned last week, we should wait for the end of the inquiry.
Then,I have just one question: did this Bowling for columbine “comedy” made you laugh? I hope you had fun watching it. Personally, it made me pretty sad…
Finally, your racist “silly french” insult isn’t appropriate.
Do mind the trolls vincent.
Sure… I’m sure it was entirely coincidental that a Jewish school would be burned to the ground in a time of increased anti-Semitic attacks. I’m sure Tariq Ramadan says the Mossad really did it.
Bowling for Columbine is a pack of crap, pure and simple. It is not a documentary, nor is it a comedy. It’s a piece of propaganda that uses misrepresentations, staged scenes, and outright lies. Michael Moore is a Leni Reifenstahl without the looks or the talent.
I’ll bet he didn’t even watch it.
I think “Bowling for Columbine” was not a comedy, and not a documentary, but it still was a very good movie! His “findings” are really innovative and clever, even though some parts are not that good.
-it IS a good way to get all the powers by scaring people, especially about an imminent and diffuse threat…
-it is not a surprise something like Columbine happens in the region were a lot of american weapons are produced. A familly cannot live in peace while the father is building missiles all day. The kids get weird.
-yes american TV is way too violent.
-yes america is still segregating people. Of course there’s no more signs “no colored people”, but the rift does exist.
-yes capital punishment is a shame, and yes the supposed deterrent effect is in fact a “bad example”.
-of course weapon control is a prerequisite if you want to stop the population to shoot at each other(this applies to Iraq as well=the first thing the french government did after world war II was to retrieve the weapons from “resistants”. The first thing the US do in Iraq is stating that each familly can own 2 kalachnikovs…).
-last but not least: of course the weapon industry has ties with the government, and nothing but popular pressure will ever make them stop.
so much for the pack of crap.
so much for the “didn’t watch it” theory
But this article was on anti-semitic europe. Let’s go back to the topic:
Europe and Europeans think that Israel’s government is a threat to world peace, because they behave like terrorists. How is that anti-semitic? I would never go and burn a school or a temple. I wouldn’t insult a jew because of that. I think the person who did that would have do something wrong anyway that day.
Europe and Europeans have nothing against jews (well, the 5% of europeans with arab origins may). They have a problem with the israelo-palestinian conflict, and the unfair way Israel is managing it, with the covering of the US.
Just as much as to hate Bush doesn’t mean you’re not patriotic = to hate Sharon doesn’t mean you’re anti-semitic.
Again, to borrow a quotation from Thomas Friedman,
“Criticizing Israel is not anti-Semitic, and saying so is vile. But singling out Israel for opprobrium and international sanction – our of all proportion to any other party in the Middle East – is anti-Semitic, and not saying so is dishonest.”
Israelis aren’t the ones blowing up innocent civilians in deliberate targeted attacks. To criticize Israel as “behaving like terrorists” while ignoring the facts of the Israeli/Palestinian crisis is anti-Semitic. One doesn’t have to be a goosestepping Nazi to be an anti-Semite. Simply singling out the Jews and holding them to a different standard than the rest of humanity is sufficient.
Furthermore, I won’t spend the days I could spend pointing out the lies of Bowling for Columbine when Spinsanity has already done an excellent job of it themselves. Moore is a hack, pure and simple, and the fact that his propaganda is accepted as gospel truth by so many is simply distressing.
Then,I have just one question: did this Bowling for columbine “comedy” made you laugh?
Bowling for Columbine is propoganda, pure and simple. At first he tried to pass it off as a documentary. Then, we pressed for facts, he claimed that its a comedy, hence he doesn’t have to back his allegations/methods up.
Europe and Europeans think that Israel’s government is a threat to world peace, because they behave like terrorists. How is that anti-semitic?
Given the reality, the above statement is very telling.
Hey Stan,
could you please be more precise than that? Just so that you know, I’ve just been reading a couple of articles from top officers of Tsahal stating that the Israeli army did really lied on the kind of weapon they were using, and on the kind of mission they were handling…it ain’t pretty let me tell you. You’re gonna need more than ONE sentence to discredit long paragraph from israelis officers…
C’mon Jay you didn’t answer my implied question. Did you see the movie or not?
I’ve just been reading a couple of articles from top officers of Tsahal stating that the Israeli army did really lied on the kind of weapon they were using,
What kind of a weapon they used where?
and on the kind of mission they were handling…
Huh?
You’re gonna need more than ONE sentence to discredit long paragraph from israelis officers…
Huh? What paragraph? What are you mumbling about? What paragraph?
Also Finally, your racist “silly french” insult isn’t appropriate.
Actually, if anything, its your insinuation that the French are a race that’s racist.
Hey Stan,
could you please be more precise than that?
Back to your question. Can you please describe as to how Israel’s government is a threat to world peace, because they behave like terrorists.? Also, if let’s say, we assume for a second that Israel behaves “like a terrorist” towards the Palestinians living in the West Bank/Gaza, then how does that make them a threat to the world peace?
Vincent,
You say that Europeans have nothing against Jews but how can you be a fair judge of that? France is being over run by Arabs, all you have to do is give birth in France and poof! You get citizenship. In the mean time, they are buying up all of you stores, your vineyards etc. you are all going to loose your culture. My point is, you have to defend these people. Your country is being over run by them.
Second you constantly defend the Palestinian people, what? They are in no way responsible for any of the actions they take? Is it the Jews fault? Give me a break, you place all the blame on the Jews are not holding Palestinians accountable.
Last, if you really want to be “european deputy” as you call it then I feel sorry for Europe. In your statements you are way to self righteous, you are quick to judge America/Israel. Things are not this easy, black/white. You have a far way to go.
Vincent,
You say that Europeans have nothing against Jews but how can you be a fair judge of that? France is being over run by Arabs, all you have to do is give birth in France and poof! You get citizenship. In the mean time, they are buying up all of you stores, your vineyards etc. you are all going to loose your culture. My point is, you have to defend these people. Your country is being over run by them.
Second you constantly defend the Palestinian people, what? They are in no way responsible for any of the actions they take? Is it the Jews fault? Give me a break, you place all the blame on the Jews are not holding Palestinians accountable.
Last, if you really want to be “european deputy” as you call it then I feel sorry for Europe. In your statements you are way to self righteous, you are quick to judge America/Israel. Things are not this easy, black/white. You have a far way to go.
Yes. Thankfully I didn’t have to pay money to see it, or I would have been demanding a refund.
“Things are not this easy, black/white”
I couldn’t agree more. When conservatives say “WITH or AGAINST us” , supporting the GOOD against the BAD, dealing with OLD and NEW Europe…I think you’re the one who’s judging me too fast chris.
As for your “arabs are taking over France”, I only have scorn for you. France is great because it has seen many origins and people on its ground.
Diversity is a force. On all arabs immigrating to France, many of them are glad to live here, and appreciate the peace of soft religion. They know that their chances are the same as other immigrants before them, and that prevent them from rioting like blacks in L.A did. In any case, what is your tip: kill them, park them, send them back?
If France was to do that, I would blame it, and arabs would too, turning into terrorists. So Yes, a country (Israel to answer your question) is more responsible than palestinians for this situation because it failed in being fair with the population they robbed the land in the first place.
oh and I almost forgot Stan:
http://www.lemonde.fr/web/article/0,1-0@2-3210,36-342969,0.html
(I know it’s in french: take it or leave it)
Vincent,
Hah! Very weak. You began rambling on about some parapgraph with has nothing to do with topic at hand. Then you post a link to an article in a language that you *know* I don’t understand? That’s laughable.
Anyway. I’ll ask you again:
Also, if let’s say, we assume for a second that Israel behaves “like a terrorist” towards the Palestinians living in the West Bank/Gaza, then how does that make them a threat to the world peace?
I provided a link to a french article because:
1-I don’t know of any article on the same topic in english (but I’m sure you’ve heard of google.com before if you’re interested.
2-Because I have no idea if you actually could speak french or not, as this may be the case.(it already happened to me on this very website to be blamed for assuming someone couldn’t speak it). My intent was in no way to kick you out of the debate
3-it’s not like I’ve been putting a link to an article in Ouzbek you know…French is the 4th language in the world…
4-you’re not the only one reaing these posts, and someone might find it interesting
And now let’s anwer your (btw stupid) question:
ever heard of chain effects? Do you know how WWI started? WWII? Did these war became global from one day to another? NO!
world wars started with random, local events, turning out to be the source of alliances games leading to larger conflicts.
If you don’t see how a conflict between jews and arabs, with many actors involved such as the EU, the US, Russia, and some neighbouring nations could lead to a major crisis, then it’s not with the french language alone that you’re lacking some knowledge!
1) My intent was in no way to kick you out of the debate
Yet you said “(I know it’s in french: take it or leave it)”
2) it’s not like I’ve been putting a link to an article in Ouzbek you know…French is the 4th language in the world…
More people speak chinese then French. You don’t see me posting links to articles in that language.
WWII? Did these war became global from one day to another? NO!
Sure. Pacifism allowed small conflicts grow into big ones. You should know something about that. You are French.
If you don’t see how a conflict between jews and arabs
Thanks for proving my point. This conflict should be between Israel and Jordan (West Bank was annexed when Jordan attacked Israel). Yet, you readily accept that its between arabs and Jews. I don’t see Jews blowing up mosques around the world, do you? Then, why are you so quick to accept the premise that this is between arabs and jews and both parties are equally responsible?
there must be some language barrier that prevents me from understanding any of your point.sorry, I don’t see any logic in any of the points you’re trying to make:
1)we’re in a pub. I say “you can stay or you can leave”. Am I kicking you out? I don’t think so!!
2) I was just saying my article is in french because I’m french and this is what I read. Do you actually read chinese press? Then why would you put an article in chinese?
3) and 4)…no you’re right. Israel could in no way aggravate the situation. AND the more warmongers around, the more peace for sure!
and on your “jews/arabs” or “israelis/palestinians” argument, here is a little reading (in english) which may prove how your subtle distinctions are only relevant to you, as Mr Sharon himself doesn’t really care about the distinction:
http://www.eupolitix.com/EN/News/1c73600d-64ed-4cd5-8ecf-c210f085f992.htm
1)we’re in a pub. I say “you can stay or you can leave”. Am I kicking you out? I don’t think so!!
Poor analogy. More like, we are engaged in a conversation in a language we both understand. Suddenly you begin speaking in a language you know I don’t speak. And you say “We can go on with this, or we can stop”. It’s obvious that since I don’t speak your language I’ld have no interest in continuing.
was just saying my article is in french because I’m french and this is what I read. Do you actually read chinese press? Then why would you put an article in chinese?
I read russian press. Do you think it would be of any use for you (or this debate) if I started posting links to russian articles?
no you’re right. Israel could in no way aggravate the situation. AND the more warmongers around, the more peace for sure!
Assuming that Israel is an agressor when it comes to Palestinians, you still haven’t made a point as to how they are a threat to world peace. Let’s assume that Sharon was as bad as Saddam. Yet, you didn’t view Saddam as a threat to world peace. How come?
As for your article – it didn’t really provide any insight into anything. Just restated the facts.
Let me ask you again. West Bank was annexed by Israel as a result of the attack by Jordan in 1967. Why is it, then, this conflict is between Jews and Arabs and not Jordan and Israel. And who made it that way?
Well, I can read French, and you’re not missing much.
Basically the article states that the IDF supposedly lied about what kind of missiles were used on an attack on October 20, 2003 near the Nusseirat refugee camp in Gaza. Seven Palestinians were killed in the attack. The insinuation was that the Israelis fired on a crowd of civilians. (The actual video of the attack taken by an IDF drone can be found here.)
Except there was no crowd of civilians, just the two target vehicles. The impact of the missiles are consistant with an attack by Hellfire missiles – in fact, if anything it’s seems to be a smaller warhead than the Hellfire.
Now, after looking at that image several things are clear. One, the video shows no crowd of civilians. Second, if the IDF had fired on a crowd, a hell of a lot more than 7 people would have been killed. We’re talking about a significant blast that would have caused significant casualties to anyone nearby.
Le Monde‘s sole source is the radical left-wing Knesset member Yossi Sarid who represents the far-left Meretz Party. There’s no evidence that supports the claim that the IDF lied other than the words of the Palestinians (who have repeatedly lied about casualties) and one left-wing Knesset member.
Of course what Le Monde doesn’t report is that car had been carrying militants that had been trying to attack an Israeli kibbutz. On that same day the IDF destroyed several workshops creating Kassam rockets to be used in attacks against Israeli civilians.
The Palestinians can deliberately kill Israeli civilians and Europe looks the other way – but when Israel defends itself they heap on the criticism.
The Palestinians can deliberately kill Israeli civilians and Europe looks the other way
Yea, how come a mere accusation by Palestinians fires up the EU, yet the fact that Palestinians threaten to kill civilians, kill civilians and then brag about killing civilians is overlooked?
To criticize Israel as “behaving like terrorists” while ignoring the facts of the Israeli/Palestinian crisis is anti-Semitic.
Yes Jay, he obviously hates Jews. C’mon now you’re being stupid.